Post by Mantishuffle on Jun 12, 2015 16:13:45 GMT -8
I have seen a few other users in other threads point out the idea. It has never crossed my mind before. So I got to thinking; how would RBY OU change if Hypnosis, Lovely Kiss, Sing, Sleep Powder, and Spore were banned?
I personally don't think I would like that. First I would consider the movesets of those who normally carry these moves in standard sets and use them in the mid and late game. In the case of Sleep Powder, Exeggutor would maybe still see use as it would now be able to paralyze and have a physical attack without dropping Explosion or Psychic, or you can just replace it with Rest. It is still the best switch into the Rock/Grounds. Victreebel would definitely still have its uses as now it would have no choice but to carry a second finishing move or Swords Dance. No one really has Sing as a standard move, so it probably won't be missed. Parasect would accomplish the impossible and suck more than it already does.
If we consider those who lead with these moves, the most practical would be Jynx, Gengar, Exeggutor, and Hypno. Hypno would basically be a slower but bulkier Alakazam with Rest for recovery, or a gimmick with Meditate or something else that sucks. Exeggutor would have less business in the lead spot than it already does. Gengar would have all the incentive it needs to be a surprise Normal immune Pokémon by not being a lead. Just replace with Confuse Ray or Mega Drain for coverage, or go crazy and swap Explosion with Rest. Jynx would be worse overall as it loses its niche as a solid sleep lead. Its only other decent options are Body Slam, Counter, and Mimic. Articuno is probably better at doubling up Ice Type attacks.
For general purposes, think of the momentum you would lose when facing something slower when the rest of the opposing team is free of status. The lead game would change drastically as half of the common positions (attacking lead and sleep lead) would no longer exist. We would see more variety in the lead game with general attackers and anti-leads. There would also be less reason to not paralyze things. Shutting down boosting sweepers with sleep would no longer be an option.
Sleep is an overpowered status ailment. That is why we have Sleep Clause. I bring this up because the clause isn't really true to the cartridge mechanics, so what would be the most appropriate way to balance it? I would propose the forced prevention of the selection of these moves after one opposing Pokémon has been put to sleep on the simulator. I like having the chance to shut down one target with these moves. Others may think that disallowing the status all together would be the way to go about it.
All in all, the cons are that some Pokémon would lose their niche, Paralysis would be a little more widespread, and an option to have favorable odds of putting something out of commission would not exist (this might be a pro for some). The pros are that there would be more variety in the lead position and more variety in some movesets. I enjoy seeing more options than though viable in this limited game.
Since I have never played RBY without Sleep Clause, and because I accept and don't really dislike the way the game plays with it, it is easy for me to say that I would not like to play without sleep inducing moves. However I have to admit it would be interesting to play with these bans as it would bring some variety, although it would be a much different game. You know how the saying goes, "can't knock it til' you try it". Obviously this is a stupid saying that doesn't apply to everything, but I think it is applicable to the topic.
So what do you guys think? How would the game change? Would it be better or worse? Is it worth test playing? Your thoughts.
I personally don't think I would like that. First I would consider the movesets of those who normally carry these moves in standard sets and use them in the mid and late game. In the case of Sleep Powder, Exeggutor would maybe still see use as it would now be able to paralyze and have a physical attack without dropping Explosion or Psychic, or you can just replace it with Rest. It is still the best switch into the Rock/Grounds. Victreebel would definitely still have its uses as now it would have no choice but to carry a second finishing move or Swords Dance. No one really has Sing as a standard move, so it probably won't be missed. Parasect would accomplish the impossible and suck more than it already does.
If we consider those who lead with these moves, the most practical would be Jynx, Gengar, Exeggutor, and Hypno. Hypno would basically be a slower but bulkier Alakazam with Rest for recovery, or a gimmick with Meditate or something else that sucks. Exeggutor would have less business in the lead spot than it already does. Gengar would have all the incentive it needs to be a surprise Normal immune Pokémon by not being a lead. Just replace with Confuse Ray or Mega Drain for coverage, or go crazy and swap Explosion with Rest. Jynx would be worse overall as it loses its niche as a solid sleep lead. Its only other decent options are Body Slam, Counter, and Mimic. Articuno is probably better at doubling up Ice Type attacks.
For general purposes, think of the momentum you would lose when facing something slower when the rest of the opposing team is free of status. The lead game would change drastically as half of the common positions (attacking lead and sleep lead) would no longer exist. We would see more variety in the lead game with general attackers and anti-leads. There would also be less reason to not paralyze things. Shutting down boosting sweepers with sleep would no longer be an option.
Sleep is an overpowered status ailment. That is why we have Sleep Clause. I bring this up because the clause isn't really true to the cartridge mechanics, so what would be the most appropriate way to balance it? I would propose the forced prevention of the selection of these moves after one opposing Pokémon has been put to sleep on the simulator. I like having the chance to shut down one target with these moves. Others may think that disallowing the status all together would be the way to go about it.
All in all, the cons are that some Pokémon would lose their niche, Paralysis would be a little more widespread, and an option to have favorable odds of putting something out of commission would not exist (this might be a pro for some). The pros are that there would be more variety in the lead position and more variety in some movesets. I enjoy seeing more options than though viable in this limited game.
Since I have never played RBY without Sleep Clause, and because I accept and don't really dislike the way the game plays with it, it is easy for me to say that I would not like to play without sleep inducing moves. However I have to admit it would be interesting to play with these bans as it would bring some variety, although it would be a much different game. You know how the saying goes, "can't knock it til' you try it". Obviously this is a stupid saying that doesn't apply to everything, but I think it is applicable to the topic.
So what do you guys think? How would the game change? Would it be better or worse? Is it worth test playing? Your thoughts.