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Post by datechnod00d on Jan 25, 2016 13:27:29 GMT -8
Hello RBY2K10 Community,
(This is the TL:DR)
I would like to propose a Vanilla RBY battling format. This is where there are no mods / clauses whatsoever; no sleep clause, no freeze clause, no evasion clause, just vanilla Pokemon, as if we were children battling each other on the playground in the late 90s.
(End TL:DR)
Why might this be a good idea?
Well, these clauses have inadvertently buffed and nerfed certain Pokemon or groups of Pokemon. The main reason that the only frequently used grass type in OU is Exeggutor is because of the sleep clause. Grass types have so many weaknesses, are very slow, and have no reliable STAB (bar Razor Leaf, which only the Bulbasaur and Bellsprout evolution lines can learn) in Gen 1, however, Game Freak gave literally every grass type Sleep Powder to counteract this. When you nerf sleep powder with Sleep Clause, you make grass types under-powered. The same is true with Ice types and the Freeze clause, however, the nerf is less significant, but OU ice-type Pokemon are also not very frequently used.
Also, vanilla Pokemon is the way Game Freak intended people to battle. Pokemon battling with the currently accepted mods / clauses isn't true Pokemon - it's kind of like a spin-off to Pokemon.
I understand that these mods / clauses are here to make the competitive meta less luck-based and more enjoyable. I'm not here to take away these mods completely. I'm here to propose a separate, vanilla RBY battling format because I think that it can be a very fun mode that gives credit to some Pokemon who don't receive it in the normal competitive meta.
(Tiers in the next post)
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Post by datechnod00d on Jan 25, 2016 13:42:10 GMT -8
RBY Vanilla Tiers:
I think that the idea of tiers is excellent; giving weaker Pokemon the competitive spotlight that they deserve. However, in this Vanilla RBY format, I am expanding this idea to giving every single Pokemon some competitive battling merit, or at least attempting to.
I made these tiers solely through theorymoning. I would highly appreciate it if people would suspect-test these tiers to make sure that nothing is really too overpowered or under-powered.
Yes, BL, BL2, BL3, and BL4 are all playable tiers, NOT banlists.
Behold, the Vanilla RBY Tiers v1.0:
1. Ubers:
- #113 Chansey (OU -> Ubers)
- #150 Mewtwo
- #151 Mew
2. OU:
- #003 Venusaur (BL -> OU)
- #036 Clefable (BL -> OU)
- #053 Persian
- #065 Alakazam
- #071 Victreebel
- #076 Golem
- #080 Slowbro
- #091 Cloyster
- #094 Gengar
- #097 Hypno (BL -> OU)
- #103 Exeggutor
- #112 Rhydon
- #121 Starmie
- #124 Jynx
- #128 Tauros
- #131 Lapras
- #135 Jolteon
- #143 Snorlax
- #144 Articuno
- #145 Zapdos
- #149 Dragonite
3. BL:
- #026 Raichu
- #034 Nidoking
- #049 Venomoth (UU -> BL)
- #051 Dugtrio
- #062 Poliwrath (UU -> BL)
- #064 Kadabra
- #073 Tentacruel
- #085 Dodrio
- #093 Haunter
- #115 Kangaskhan
- #122 Mr. Mime
- #130 Gyarados
- #146 Moltres
4. UU:
- #006 Charizard
- #020 Raticate
- #024 Arbok
- #028 Sandslash
- #031 Nidoqueen (BL -> UU)
- #055 Golduck
- #061 Poliwhirl
- #075 Graveler
- #099 Kingler
- #114 Tangela
- #125 Electabuzz
- #134 Vaporeon
- #149 Dragonair
5. BL2:
- #015 Butterfree
- #018 Pidgeot
- #038 Ninetales
- #045 Vileplume
- #047 Parasect
- #057 Primeape
- #059 Arcanine
- #060 Poliwag
- #063 Abra
- #068 Machamp
- #082 Magneton
- #087 Dewgong
- #092 Gastly
- #095 Onix
- #096 Drowzee
- #110 Weezing
- #120 Staryu
- #123 Scyther
- #127 Pinsir
- #136 Flareon
6. RU:
- #002 Ivysaur
- #009 Blastoise
- #022 Fearow
- #040 Wigglytuff
- #054 Psyduck
- #070 Weepinbell
- #078 Rapidash
- #079 Slowpoke
- #089 Muk
- #101 Electrode
- #105 Marowak
- #106 Hitmonlee
- #108 Lickitung
- #117 Seadra
- #119 Seaking
- #126 Magmar
- #137 Porygon
- #139 Omastar
- #141 Kabutops
- #142 Aerodactyl
- #148 Dratini
7. BL3:
- #005 Charmeleon
- #008 Wartortle
- #015 Beedrill
- #017 Pidgeotto
- #025 Pikachu
- #042 Golbat
- #044 Gloom
- #052 Meowth
- #067 Machoke
- #072 Tentacool
- #074 Geodude
- #077 Ponyta
- #081 Magnemite
- #107 Hitmonchan
- #111 Rhyhorn
8. NU:
- #001 Bulbasaur
- #019 Rattata
- #021 Spearow
- #023 Ekans
- #027 Sandshrew
- #030 Nidorina
- #033 Nidorino
- #035 Clefairy
- #038 Jigglypuff
- #043 Oddish
- #037 Vulpix
- #046 Paras
- #048 Venonat
- #050 Diglett
- #056 Mankey
- #058 Growlithe
- #069 Bellsprout
- #083 Farfetch'd
- #084 Doduo
- #086 Seel
- #090 Shellder
- #098 Krabby
- #100 Voltorb
- #109 Koffing
- #116 Horsea
- #138 Omanyte
- #140 Kabuto
9. BL4:
- #004 Charmander
- #007 Squirtle
- #016 Pidgey
- #029 Nidoran♀
- #032 Nidoran♂
- #041 Zubat
- #043 Oddish
- #066 Machop
- #088 Grimer
- #104 Cubone
- #118 Goldeen
- #133 Eevee
10. PU:
- #010 Caterpie
- #011 Metapod
- #013 Weedle
- #014 Kakuna
- #129 Magikarp
- #132 Ditto
There are some things that I wasn't quite sure about, and so if people are interested in suspect-testing, these Pokemon may deserve priority:
1) Moltres - is it balanced enough or BL, or should it be moved up to OU?
2) Tangela - is it balanced enough for UU, or should it be moved up to BL?
3) Charmander - is it balanced enough for BL4, or should it be moved up to NU?
4) Venusaur - is it good enough for OU, or should it be moved down to BL?
5) Jolteon - is it good enough for OU, or should it be moved down to BL?
6) Venomoth - is it good enough for BL, or should it be moved down to UU?
7) Charizard - is it good enough for UU, or should it be moved down to BL2?
8) Arbok - is it good enough for UU, or should it be moved down to BL2?
9) Abra - is it good enough for BL2, or should it be moved down to RU?
10) Caterpie, Metapod, Magikarp - are they viable options in PU?
(Note that I will be editing this list from time to time as I find more possible queries)
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Post by piexplode on Jan 30, 2016 1:08:24 GMT -8
I think with vanilla RBY it's best to just start with mew/mewtwo banned as the main and only draw to this format is playing the game in a way that someone totally new would like to play it. Making a bajillion tiers to start off with is pointless especially when you've not really tested anything, even on here. Also I think that back on Azure Heights the game was played like that a lot, so I'd probably dig on there if you would like to know more about the game. A little piece of info lodged in my head was that the standard Hypno had the name pandora hypno, was something like double team psychic rest seismic toss if I remember correctly.
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Post by datechnod00d on Jan 30, 2016 16:21:45 GMT -8
OK. So to start off, there will only be 2 tiers: 1) Ubers - All Pokemon permitted 2) OU - All Pokemon permitted except for Mewtwo and Mew The reason that I wanted to ban Chansey into Ubers is because it can learn Sing and Minimize, and I thought it would be too difficult to KO in OU. However, I think that if you can get a faster sleeper (really, every sleeper in OU outspeeds Chansey), you can put it too sleep, then start hammering away. So thank you for the revision ( piexplode). When there are people willing to suspect-test the lower tiers, we will make the lower tiers based on the suspect tests. I thought it would be interesting to see all Pokemon get some sort of usage, since Vanilla RBY OU in this case would only see a handful of Pokemon being used - Chansey, Exeggutor, Gengar, Hypno, Jynx, Victreebel, etc. I'd want to be able to use my favorite Gen 1 Pokemon (Blastoise, Vaporeon, etc.) in Vanilla RBY, but they would get their asses kicked by the more powerful Pokemon in OU. So that's why I created so many tiers (although honestly, the Smogon XY meta has more tiers than this). |
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